"Ask A Jew" Wednesday

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[u/myownpersonallab]

Fellow Jews, how do you fortify your soul against seeing actual antisemitism in Palestine liberation spaces? I keep seeing the Protocols of the Elders of Zion and claims of being devil worshippers and it has only gotten worse this month. I have been called a Zionist shill for pointing it out. The argument that we don't want fascist white supremacist arguments in our liberation spaces is getting less and less effective. :( I am always met with.... well this is nothing compared to what Palestinians are going through.

And it's true. It's not.

I will stay involved no matter what. Palestine will be free in our lifetimes and I will not stand by. But generations of trauma in my blood is wearing away at my armor at the moment.

[u/_II_I_I__I__I_I_II_ → u/myownpersonallab]

I had a personal incident like this that made me feel really angry/frustrated/sad.

I'm glad I'm here in this space, where we can advocate on behalf of Palestinian human rights but also oppose genuine antisemitism, because this cause transcends all of that.

TBF though, I only see that kind of bigotry online. IRL, people are much more conscientious. Especially in organized activism.

[u/sudo_apt-get_intrnet → u/_II_I_I__I__I_I_II_]

TBF though, I only see that kind of bigotry online. IRL, people are much more conscientious. Especially in organized activism.

I really wish I had the same experience as you -- online I find it easy to dodge the antisemitism but IRL it seems it always finds me in leftist spaces (likely because that's mostly where I exist IRL, but still).

[u/Greatsayain → u/myownpersonallab]

It should be as simple as "don't do this wrong thing while fighting for the right thing". Who cares that their wrong is smaller in magnitude than the wrong they are fighting. It would cost nothing to just refrain from antisemitism while helping Palestinians. I'm sorry I don't have anything more useful than that.

[u/Cornexclamationpoint → u/myownpersonallab]

I've almost entirely abandoned r/badhasbara because of this.  As a disclaimer, the vast majority of the posts there are fine, but every once in a while there will be one or two that are fairly antisemitic that get a score of up-votes.  Jews are European larpers, Zionists control the US government, excessive sarcastic usages of "that's antisemitic," stuff like that.  It's 100% an echo chamber and any push back gets you down voted.  That's the great thing about big tent ideologies.  If you find one group that doesn't suit you, you're perfectly able to leave and find one that you fit in much better.  For Jews, this sub is a thousand times more accepting and culturally/religiously relevant.

[u/Saul_al-Rakoun → u/Cornexclamationpoint]

To be fair, there's a 1975 Memorandum of Understanding between Gerald Ford and Isaac Rabin that gives Israel veto powers over US diplomatic initiatives. I wish I were making this up.

Since you yourself brought up Bad Hasbara, I will simply say "Octopus Suit".

[u/Cornexclamationpoint → u/Saul_al-Rakoun]

The only type of memorandums like this that I have seen refer specifically to peace accords between Israel and Egypt and Syria, where Henry Kissinger assured that the US would be on Israel's side. Considering that Egypt and Syria were full-blown members of the Soviet sphere of influence, it doesn't seem like they would have needed a lot of coaxing to take this stance. If there is some other agreement that I missed, I'd appreciate a bit more info to do some googling.

[u/sudo_apt-get_intrnet → u/myownpersonallab]

If I could add a tagalong on to this, what's the best way to start if you're afraid of the antisemitism in the movement? Every time I've tried reaching out to even start getting more involved I've bounced back from antisemitism -- I'm sensitive to it from previous experiences and my first instinct when faced with it is a strong urge to leave any situation where I encounter it.

[u/Saul_al-Rakoun → u/sudo_apt-get_intrnet]

Entryism, essentially. Start by building a local member-owned and member-run organization of like-minded Jews, and then operate collectively. This is essentially how Marxists had to operate in the DSA during its High Identity Politics days when any discussion of class relations in an allegedly socialist organization were met by Liberals screaming about "class reductionism", "Red-Brown alliances" and "Strasserism". In fact, it's how the Marxists in DSA still have to operate against the Democrat-party (hence: Capitalist henchmen) proxy groups of "Socialist Majority Caucus" and "Groundwork".

What you do is that collectively, you and your fellow anti-Zionist Jews work out and adopt a plan of action. You then execute the plan of action together, and periodically regroup to talk about how it's going. That would mean getting involved in the movement collectively, rather than individually. If I ever were to join JVP, this is how I would do so.

[u/Dis-Organizer → u/Saul_al-Rakoun]

As someone who is mostly DSA adjacent but has started (somewhat to my own chagrin) learning more about the internal politics, your description of how Marxists have to operate in DSA (and sounds like it used to be worse) and the way you describe groundwork and socialist majority caucus is so helpful and affirms what I’ve been picking up here and there

[u/Dis-Organizer → u/myownpersonallab]

I’ve got a specific question off of this. I generally let questionable rhetoric slide because I understand we’re witnessing genocide on our phones and it’s horrific, climate disasters are hitting us all more frequently, ongoing pandemic that’s being erased with more likely to come etc. Just everyone is on edge, people are being materially impacted by a lot, and a lot of antisemitism that I see on the left isn’t nefarious, more accidental?

Especially because I exist in some spaces with people “newer” to Palestine as an issue (where I tend to experience more of this sorta accidentally said something questionably antisemitic thing). My specific question is around the term “Zio.” I found out accidentally that a non Jewish friend who is in similar, overlapping but different spaces had a Jewish member of one of her groups bring it up in one group they’re in. People were very receptive learning that it’s used by neo-Nazis, David Duke, etc. Their story stuck out to me because I know people in one of the groups I’m in have definitely used it to refer to Zionists (and usually in the context of the IOF or someone committing an atrocity)

I’m sure there have been other similar moments but that’s been the one on my mind, a specific group where at least some members have used “Zio” before, to mean Zionists and likely without having the context—these are all real people I know and I’m not the only Jewish person in the space, but there is a range of knowledge and experience when it comes to Palestine, activism, and left politics more broadly.

Just curious if other people have been calling in their comrades and if so, what that looks like and where their “line” is

[u/Saul_al-Rakoun → u/Dis-Organizer]

I was introduced to "Zio" by Matt Lieb and Daniel Maté, and it's kind of obvious how you get there -- and not this "Oh no David Duke!!!11" tone policing dreck.

Look, if we cared what white supremacists thought and said we wouldn't use the term "Zionist", because when they use it, they use it to mean the K-word or in the sense of the "Elders of Zion". In fact, one has to do the same situational parsing to determine in either case, so "Zio" doesn't bother me.

[u/angsty_geologist → u/myownpersonallab]

I have been dealing with similar feelings. It’s difficult. I am lucky to have a small group of anti-Zionist Jewish friends with whom I can commiserate about all of this, which helps, though venting alone doesn’t really solve this problem.

I think trauma can really bring out the worst in people. This includes bigotry. I try to be conscientious of this when interacting with people who veer into ignorant, antisemitic talking points. A lot of the concerning comments I’ve seen/heard from other organizers and activists seem like they come from a place of deep pain and despair. Maybe it is not so dissimilar from the way Jewish Zionists essentially blame Palestinians for their own very real history of trauma. Reminding myself of this makes it easier to brush off hurtful, bigoted comments.

I do believe that one of Israel’s “goals” with their ongoing genocide in Palestine (and military aggression across the board) is to increase antisemitism against Jews in the diaspora. I am pretty sure the Israeli government is hoping that diaspora Jews will settle in Israel to escape said antisemitism, helping Israel maintain a Jewish majority well into the future. So, in some way, calling out antisemitism in the Palestine liberation movement (and in broader society IN GENERAL) is a way to resist Israel’s agenda. I try to remind people of this when I hear antisemitic canards repeated uncritically. It doesn’t always work, but I try nonetheless.

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