r/JewsOfConscience • u/jewraffe5 LGBTQ Jew • Sep 02 '24
Opinion Need to vent/seeking support
Flaired as opinion but lmk if I need to delete/change flair...sorry I'm new here.
Basically just need to vent - it feels impossible to discuss the situation in Israel/Palestine with my parents and I feel like it's made our already somewhat shallow relationship even more so...
Backstory is I'm Ashkenazi and was raised modern Orthodox and went to private Jewish schools from pre-K until 12th grade. In case that doesn't make it obvious, the Pro Israel indoctrination was STRONG. It's only been in more recent years, and frankly this current "war" (is it a war when it's this one sided? I still have a hard time using the word genocide bc of Holocaust associations but...) has broken me in terms of Israel and honestly pushed me away from the thin shred of Judaism I've been holding on to.
I feel disconnected from my family who is still so blindly pro-Israel, thinking this war is justified in anyway and never mentioning the thousands of Palestinians brutally murdered or any other wrongdoing Israel and the IDF do. It does not feel worth the stress of engaging with my parents about this topic and then I feel guilty for having the privilege of avoiding discussing this "issue" while real lives are being TAKEN by a country doing it supposedly "for my sake".
I'll cut this off here before it gets longer, but are other folks dealing with this with family members? It sucks.
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u/isawasin Non-Jewish Ally Sep 02 '24
As a non-jewish ally writing to you from the middle east. Thank you for having the courage of your convictions. You are very much appreciated.
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u/BodhisattvaBob Non-denominational Sep 02 '24
Honestly, likewise. Thank you for being able to take in all the pictures and videos and news articles and feeling what a normal human being feels while yet understanding that, just because a tribe has lost its mind, that doesnt mean every one of its members have.
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u/deadlift215 Jewish Anti-Zionist Sep 02 '24
I feel for you. Although not as heated I can’t really talk to my Reform parents about it either and I have some relatives who aren’t speaking to me at all now because of my criticism of Biden and Israel. Several friends and acquaintances as well. You should look into joining JVP or IfNotNow so you can at least meet some other Jews who understand and if you want you can become politically active with those organizations so you don’t feel like you are just watching all of this with no actions taken.
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u/ezkori Ashkenazi, American, raised in orthodoxy, currently cultural Sep 02 '24
I truly feel and am going through the same thing. Went to modox school too and it’s just so entrenched in the community. Just know we’re here with you and to support you.
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u/Baby_Needles Sep 02 '24
wow…I can totally relate. It’s like some giant invisible switch was flipped and we aren’t allowed to talk about it. The people who taught me about grace and understanding and forgiveness now all look to me like wolves.
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u/Roy4Pris Zionism is a waste of Judaism Sep 02 '24
The people who taught me about grace and understanding and forgiveness now all look to me like wolves.
Damn that's evocative. Oooof.
The feeling of community and personal sharing in this sub is off the charts. I applaud everyone who supports each other through this extraordinarily hard time.
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u/Vikiliex Jewish Anti-Zionist Sep 02 '24
Many of us are struggling the same way you do, but as individuals, we can only do so much.
Don't be too hard on yourself. Once our united voice breaks through and gets listened to, I'm sure your parents will listen as well.
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u/jewraffe5 LGBTQ Jew Sep 02 '24
Thanks and thanks to everyone else who's been replying and sharing, it's been really comforting
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u/Specialist-Gur Ashkenazi Sep 02 '24
I feel you and you’re not alone. Welcome ♥️ it takes tremendous strength to be able to recognize it and stand up for what’s right! A lot of us here have similar feelings and stories, myself included
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u/xarjun Anti-Zionist Sep 02 '24
I think you'll find most of us are in that boat.
Your ability to challenge, break out of your indoctrination and think critically is a massive victory against the cult of hate.
Look after your mental health. Treat those still indoctrinated and still within the cult with some compassion... And keep engaging positively.
Stay strong!
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u/PlinyToTrajan Non-Jewish Ally (Jewish ancestry & relatives) Sep 02 '24
You are taking the moral position and the long-term will be kinder to outspoken people on this issue than the short-term will.
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u/Roy4Pris Zionism is a waste of Judaism Sep 02 '24
and honestly pushed me away from the thin shred of Judaism I've been holding on to.
I understand what you mean, but as an outsider who looks on with envy at the incredible bonds of love, compassion and thoughtfulness your community has for one another, that have existed for thousands of years before and throughout the Zionist project, I would say to you to embrace your religious culture even more tightly, but alongside those with the same values of universal humanity that you have.
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u/torontogal1986 Sep 02 '24
Going through the same thing. Not sure what to say but know that you’re not alone ❤️
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u/Welcomefriend2023 Post-Zionist Sep 05 '24
I grew up in a time and a place (1950s/1960s) when the only Orthodox Jews who were pro zionist were what we called "non observant Orthodox", or nominally Orthodox ( iow Jews who attended an Orthodox shul etc bc there wasn't anything else).
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u/Taarguss Reconstructionist Sep 02 '24
Yeah this is definitely a tough situation, but we need to stop with the feeling guilty for having our own human emotions when other bad stuff is happening in the world. What are we supposed to be, relative pain sensing robots? No. Feel how you feel. It’s valid and real. To be honest, there’s been worse stuff than Gaza happening all over the world for all of human history. Should we all feel conflicted about being sad about things in our lives?
I’m sorry to be stern here and I know you’re going through it but I’ve been in lefty circles for half my life now and I see this sentiment all the time and it’s not good for the soul to feel bad for having your own hurt feelings. We have to take care of ourselves too. And honestly the type of people who seem to shut themselves off from caring about anything in their lives but the big awful issue are generally huge pains in the ass. They’re the types to scold others for thinking about anything else. Like, no. Feel how you feel. Your family situation hurts. There’s not actually much you can do for Gaza. Help where you can. Try to talk to your family about this if you can. If that doesn’t work, help in other ways. Find trustworthy funds to kick some money to. There’s a decent amount of people raising money to get across the Egyptian border (you have to basically bribe the border guards). Help them if you can and be better than your parents on this issue but don’t feel bad about being upset.
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u/jewraffe5 LGBTQ Jew Sep 02 '24
No I totally agree, it's something I think about a lot and honestly try not to do (feeling guilty for feeling badly about stuff in my life) but it's a hard habit to break.
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u/Taarguss Reconstructionist Sep 03 '24
I getchoo. Yeah just remember that we’re all people and we all have emotional needs. We all want to be loved and cared for and understood. We just don’t feel good if we don’t have that stuff.
In comparison to mass killing, yeah, it’s small potatoes but it’s your life. It’s the only one you’ve got. You have a right to want to be emotionally fulfilled.
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u/stand_not_4_me Sep 04 '24
this current "war" (is it a war when it's this one sided?
as you have received many words of sympathy and welcome which i echo in other comments i wanted to address this point since i love semantics.
technically yes it is a war and a war can be one sided. the reason is there are people firing back at the IDF. But just because it is a war in the technical sense does not mean we should in any way pretend this is a fair fight conducted in a well organized manner. Personally to i do not like calling it a genocide, as it does not feel right, but of recent i also dont like calling it a war. the longer neither side is willing to budge for an end, the longer this will take and the worse the outcome will be for both sides. i feel palestinian civilians are a third consideration in this fight and i dont like it. especially since i do not see conquest as a way to keep israelis safe.
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u/Saul_al-Rakoun Conservadox & Marxist Sep 02 '24
I know what you mean.
The genocide of the Palestinians is a topic that I have to tiptoe around with my wife, as she is doubleplusgoodthinkful.
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u/lizzmell Jewish Anti-Zionist Sep 02 '24
I’m sorry you’re going through this, just because things are worse in Gaza doesn’t mean your situation isn’t stressful.
Ultimately I don’t think you have to talk to your family about all of this. I feel like it’s a very liberal fantasy that simply having conversations with people can change institutional biases and power structures! Make your convictions known as much as you are comfortable especially in case there are people around you who feel similar, but in my experience,extremely tense conversations with people who cling hard to Israel aren’t that productive.
If you live in or near a mid to large sized city, I’d encourage you to try and find some like minded Jews, there are more of us than our mainstream institutions would have you believe. It can be very cathartic to talk with people who are going through the same thing and then also still do Jewish things without the implicit support for the state of Israel.