Feeling tokenised on this sub

[u/Jche98]

I've been getting the impression lately that so much of this sub is becoming posts like "as jews of conscience, what do you think of X?" or "as real jews who believe in real judaism, what do you think of Y?" These questions are from non-jews. I appreciate non-jewish allies taking part in this sub but lately it's feeling that it's just people trying to paint us as "the good jews". This sub is about being jewish and anti-Zionist and the struggles that come with that. It's not a sub for us to parade around claiming to be the "true jews" or for people to parade us around like that. We are jewish and we oppose Zionism but the Zionist jews are also jewish. We're no less or more jewish than they are. And we're not here to justify judaism in the face of Zionism. There are a million (very important) subs where there is general discussion about Palestine and the genocide in Gaza. But I feel like this sub should be something for us.

[u/Partyinmykonos]

I agree this sub can sometimes feel like a fishbowl and not a 100% safe space to participate in full. I appreciate allies supporting us, but some of their questions/posts feel a little insensitive, and even goading at times. That is probably not their intent, but can just come off that way. I don’t want to project, but sometimes I feel like I need my thoughts and feelings to be validated by non-Jews and to prove my anti-Zionism in a way. This should be a safe space where we don’t feel those fears and can be honest about the questions we’re grappling with and our thoughts/feelings.

I really do not mean to judge or offend, but I also think it’s a little strange how non-Jews routinely insert their POV in this sub - tbh, it’s not totally unlike a straight person voicing their opinion in a queer sub or a white person in a BIPOC-centered sub. Or perhaps a better comparison - if I, a Jew, were to engage in a sub meant for, say, progressive Catholics. Again, I do appreciate allies coming here to learn and engage, but I would just implore them to remember that they are guests in this home.

[u/Specialist-Gur → u/Partyinmykonos]

Yes well said

[u/openstandards → u/Partyinmykonos]

I understand what you're saying and I completely agree however are you factoring in neurodiversity?

I only say this because I think I have complex ADHD (something I only discovered last year-ish), now this leads me different rabbit holes not exactly good for my mental health so I hang out here because I generally see fewer anti-semitic posts, the people tend to be decent people and yeah not going to lie I do find Jewish culture fascinating as it is so diverse.

Culture is also something to factor in as different countries have different values and trying to apply one set standard would be extremely difficult as the internet doesn't really have boundaries as such.

I'm glad this place exists, the mods seem to do a decent job at keeping the place in order which can't be easy with what's going on in the world.

[u/Partyinmykonos → u/openstandards]

Oh totally! I have raging ADHD and find myself going down rabbit holes as well. I’m sorry if my initial comment came off as dismissive towards other neurodiverse people.

I completely agree that this should be an inclusive space where non-Jews feel welcome to learn and engage. I guess what I really meant to say was that it can sometimes feel like posts from other Jews face some unfair scrutiny in the comments and some of the posts in here from non-Jews can feel a little insensitive at times. It makes me feel a little bit uncomfortable to voice my opinion for fear of undue scrutiny. I know I personally—and likely many other members of this group—are in the process of actively decolonizing our minds and unlearning a lot of what we had been taught growing up about Israel, Zionism, our faith, our collective history, etc., and also confronting difficult questions about our relationships with loved ones who hold onto Zionist beliefs. It can be a bit of a mindfuck, so I guess I’m just asking non-Jews to have grace within this group and enter it with a nonjudgmental lens (but by no means should we forgo holding others accountable when necessary).

And I don’t believe in setting a standard for this or asking the mods to start censoring folks. I would just ask non-Jews to have sensitivity in this group. At the end of the day, this is a Judaism-centric group and I want it to feel like a safe space for my fellow anti-Zionist Jews and still an inclusive space for our allies.

[u/openstandards → u/Partyinmykonos]

NO No it didn't , it's just a reminder to people that not everyone is created the same we are only really discovering the different between neurotypcial and neurodiverse.

I can't speak for anyone but myself and everyone has their own standards on what is deemed offensive. I'm not old but I'm not young either I've seen how things have changed over time and I know standards aren't the same over the board.

I'm a firm believer in if you do or say anything offensive, apologise and try to move on communication is key thou so I believe we are in agreement

I hang around a lot of queer spaces and still find it hard to ask someone their pronouns so end up using a gender-neutral term if order no to be offensive however some will find that offensive this leads to awkwardness.

I'm still trying to understand Jewish culture I've only met one Jewish person in my life (that I know of ) and they are secular not going to lie the culture like most cultures interests me.

Seeing the post I have about how many anti-Zionists Jews are alienated from their family and friends is important for others to see as it shows how courageous and loving they are.

Facism is no doubt on the rise, anti-Semitism has certainly increased that's why quite a few allies just end up here because they don't want to be part of that racist rhetoric.