r/blackgirls Sep 02 '12

University sponsors campaign to undermine 'white privilege' in one of the "whitest" cities in the US

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2162793/University-sponsors-campaign-undermine-white-privilege-whitest-cities-U-S.html
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u/[deleted] Sep 04 '12

I corrected myself around a hour before you made that post. Penal - Penile, theirs a correlation there.

I would agree about the drug offenses - However they shouldn't be doing drugs to begin with, I understand that they break the laws, but drugs are drugs. Like playing a game of risk - sooner or later it's going to catch up. That doesn't mean I disagree about the punishments - I feel they should be re-habituated in a drug rehab program, or just probation. Doing hard labor for a joint and costing tax payers upwards of half a million is ludacris.

When it comes to taking out loans - Okay. It's not something I ever think about or care for, if you want to protest against Wells Fargo more power to you.

You tell me black people aren't living in white neighborhoods - but yet I know atleast 5 black houses in the suburb I'm living in. I hold firm that they have equal opportunity, it's against the law otherwise. All ethnicity's do and there is a sub-conscious mental block that's been instilled by victim mentality, you were born like everyone else with the same opportunity it's up to you how you'll utilize it. You won't get far by asking for handouts though. If Wells Fargo breaks the law, SUE THEM. If somebody treats you unequal or breaks the law, SUE THEM. What is the average white person suppose to say? "yeah, here. take half my income, my home, and my girlfriend" ? Really ?

For every statistic you give me, I could 9 times out of 10 find a counter one on the internet. I'm not impressed by it, shit happens to blacks and whites. By sounding like Malcolm X - asserting this view that modern black people in the 21st century are lesser than whites - this is just absurd. I've never seen it with my own eyes - I can read about it, but that's not what I grew up with. Not every single urban area will be like a suburban area. Things are the way they are for reasons - It would be nice if everybody lived in peace and harmony, and the urban areas were just as prosperous and nice as the other areas.. but that's unlikely to happen.

This seems like a big fat romanticization of segregation. Even given some depressing numbers, black people as a group have never been more educated than they are today. So let me be clear, there is plenty of blame to go around and your comments sound eerily close to prentending that racism is invisible and that people are making up barriers to their success. Still, parents still need to place an emphasis on excellence. And blaming people for buying into a culture of consumerism doesn't somehow explain institutional barriers to accumulating wealth (buying assets like houses, job discrimination, access to higher education, etc.). All that is happening is that black people are being punished more severely for being more misinformed than white people, but that's not anything new.

Doesn't self-segregation already take place? It doesn't haveto be institutionalized. For instance I enjoy speaking with culturally diverse people, being that I'm white it is interesting to hear what their views are. However that doesn't mean they're completely true, it's nice hearing a different perspective.

Say what you will about them, but they do speak on violence, and both have been vocal critiques of hip hop. 5 While both haven't been controversy free, I don't really think it's your place as a white person to really be commenting on their benefit to Black America as activists.

They aren't activists, they're snakes who say one thing and do another. Never critical about the real problems, but placing blame on everybody else. That's why poverty is increasing, mentality and moral fabric diminishing. One real black leader is pastor James David Manning who is probably the best role model I can think of. (Equality - Doesn't matter if I'm white, I can still have views and opinions.)

You haven't answered about why black society has eroded so much since then. All the way up to the civil rights era, everybody dressed and acted classy, after it... whole different attitudes emerged. Mass poverty now compared to before - I feel it's impart because of the countries economical situation and big corporations getting bigger. I myself would rather bring black communities up to the same standard as whites, instead of black communities bringing the white ones to a lower standard. Would you prefer to see the betterment of all - or just for blacks?

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u/BlackSuperSonic Sep 05 '12

You tell me black people aren't living in white neighborhoods - but yet I know at least 5 black houses in the suburb I'm living in.

I'll stop here first. Yes, there may be black people living in your suburb. But +5 black households compared to how many thousand people? I'll again ask you to read some of the links I have given you. It remains that the average black person that lives in a metropolitan area in this country lives in a neighborhood that is 41% black but the average white person lives in a neighborhood that is 75% white. Black people and white people more often than not are not living in the same neighborhoods in many of this nation's cities.

I hold firm that they have equal opportunity, it's against the law otherwise. All ethnicity's do and there is a sub-conscious mental block that's been instilled by victim mentality, you were born like everyone else with the same opportunity it's up to you how you'll utilize it. You won't get far by asking for handouts though.

Again this is a just world fallacy that I have pointed out to you. The well it's against the law so it must not be happening thinking that I've put a decent effort in citing sources why this isn't true. You say there is equal opportunity, I say there isn't. And if by handouts, you mean access to a quality education, then I'll agree that I am asking for handouts.

What is the average white person suppose to say? "yeah, here. take half my income, my home, and my girlfriend" ? Really ?

What exactly are you getting at here? What are you trying to say?

For every statistic you give me, I could 9 times out of 10 find a counter one on the internet. I'm not impressed by it, shit happens to blacks and whites. By sounding like Malcolm X - asserting this view that modern black people in the 21st century are lesser than whites - this is just absurd.

Then by all means, find them and show them to me. I've put effort that everything I have said in this conversation I have been able to point at a source to back up my claim. If you want to question the information in my sources, feel free but you haven't thus far. And you also haven't answered my question to you, what privileges do I get from society for being black?

I'm not being rhetorical so I don't understand your objection. You asked me to show you the data behind my assertion that white people in this country have privilege that black people and other ethnic minorities don't and I gave it to you. Don't believe me? Ask the women in this subreddit. Go to some other popular black, Latin@ or Asian subreddits and ask them if they think white privilege exists. You might be surprised.

I've never seen it with my own eyes - I can read about it, but that's not what I grew up with. Not every single urban area will be like a suburban area. Things are the way they are for reasons - It would be nice if everybody lived in peace and harmony, and the urban areas were just as prosperous and nice as the other areas.. but that's unlikely to happen.

You just said it. You haven't seen it. But I'm putting data in front of you and you're dismissing it because you haven't seen it. Do you not see the logical leap you are making?

Doesn't self-segregation already take place? It doesn't haveto be institutionalized.

I'm not completely sure what your point is here but voluntary segregation where people have the agency to choose where they live, compared to housing segregation where people are restricted by illegal finance practices are not the same thing.

They aren't activists, they're snakes who say one thing and do another. Never critical about the real problems, but placing blame on everybody else. That's why poverty is increasing, mentality and moral fabric diminishing. One real black leader is pastor James David Manning who is probably the best role model I can think of. (Equality - Doesn't matter if I'm white, I can still have views and opinions.)

You have the right to express your opinion, but that doesn't mean I have to treat it as valid. As far as I am concerned, Pastor Manning is a demagogue that people who hate President Obama and civil rights leaders prop up that I don't take seriously.

You haven't answered about why black society has eroded so much since then. All the way up to the civil rights era, everybody dressed and acted classy, after it... whole different attitudes emerged. Mass poverty now compared to before - I feel it's impart because of the countries economical situation and big corporations getting bigger.

First you never asked me that, and to be honest I'm not all that interested in answering. And I will ask you one last time to stop romaticizing legal segregation. The era you are talking about had +50% poverty rates in black communities. There have never been lower rate than there were about 10 years ago.

I myself would rather bring black communities up to the same standard as whites, instead of black communities bringing the white ones to a lower standard. Would you prefer to see the betterment of all - or just for blacks?

That is something we can both agree upon. The question is how, and for that question we probably have different answers. I am for policies that benefit everyone, but that doesn't and shouldn't mean that they benefit everyone equally.

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u/[deleted] Sep 05 '12

I'll stop here first. Yes, there may be black people living in your suburb. But +5 black households compared to how many thousand people? I'll again ask you to read some of the links I have given you. It remains that the average black person that lives in a metropolitan area in this country lives in a neighborhood that is 41% black but the average white person lives in a neighborhood that is 75% white. Black people and white people more often than not are not living in the same neighborhoods in many of this nation's cities.

Well - I went to school with far more. I was more speaking about the neighborhood, in which 5 houses are compared to the, say 20 that I'm aware of. Blacks make up 14% of the population - Are you saying that for every 20 whites, there should be 20 blacks in suburban houses - even though that would exceed everyone else's portion?

Again this is a just world fallacy that I have pointed out to you. The well it's against the law so it must not be happening thinking that I've put a decent effort in citing sources why this isn't true. You say there is equal opportunity, I say there isn't. And if by handouts, you mean access to a quality education, then I'll agree that I am asking for handouts.

It's a victim mentality that blocks you from thinking otherwise. You cannot cognitively look at life from the perspective as a white person, because you're hard-wired this way based on your environment and past history. I do feel everybody should be entitled to quality education - It should start at home. If a single teenage mother has a child, she probably isn't educated enough to raise the child properly - it takes a community. If that community is full of crooks, ignorance, and such.. that child's future is in jeopardy to become another statistic.

What is the average white person suppose to say? "yeah, here. take half my income, my home, and my girlfriend" ? Really ? "What exactly are you getting at here? What are you trying to say?"

I'm saying that I won't yield what I have for anybody. I earned it and don't feel that giving it up because another person doesn't have that, would be be pretty stupid. For example - you have a white person that worked hard all his life to build to what he has - are you saying that a black person who say, didn't work as hard, should be given a bigger break and give them all of what I have for free even though they're undeserving and didn't work hard the way I did - on the sake of equality?

I'd prefer to revert to the real world on what I see everyday - as opposed to statistics that are just words. I could provide copious amounts of factual data which would suggest things - however I wouldn't want to be looked upon as a racist in doing so since I'm not.

I lived in both easy and hard areas - in the hard areas, the black and white kids got along great and I didn't see any of this "racism" - in the easy areas - they still got along great, you are suppose to be a minority because you are a minority ! What will you say by 2050 when Hispanics are the majority population in America ? What then?

If you get free- housing, I don't care where you live. You're getting it for free - as far as I'm concerned, it's my tax dollars that are paying for your lack of success. Theirs agencies set up to find people jobs - I'm not sure why minorities don't utilize them. Also blacks aren't the only ones in public housing - I've known of whites who were, and inside the apartment was pretty decent. When you go to an ATM at night, and looking over your shoulder. Are you more afraid of cops, or criminal gangtas ?

Pastor Manning is a great man who speaks how it actually is - MLK was also a great man who spoke how things are. Jesse Jackson, Al, they are not. If anything they cause more racism - Ask any white person what they think of those two. They don't unite - but separate.

Just because we had segregation then - doesn't mean it's what I'm referring to. I'm saying, how come the trends of modern day have dwindled down to such new lows - that everybody dresses and acts trashy? Media influence? Home influence? What is it ?? Looking at the pictures - They looked pretty healthy, successful, with gainful employment. Now you see the communities obese, unemployed, lazy and ignorant.

I just went to get new glasses yesterday. There were 5 employees - 2 of them were black. When a black customer came in, they gave them more attention - they familiarized and because they were black, acted more easy going to them. Making up only 14% of the population - how much representation should they have? Should every predominately white business, hire half of them minorities just cause? - don't think anything of it, but it made me wonder.

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u/BlackSuperSonic Sep 05 '12

Well - I went to school with far more. I was more speaking about the neighborhood, in which 5 houses are compared to the, say 20 that I'm aware of. Blacks make up 14% of the population - Are you saying that for every 20 whites, there should be 20 blacks in suburban houses - even though that would exceed everyone else's portion?

No, I neither said nor implied that. I said that on average black and white people live in different neighborhoods and you supplied your anecdotal evidence. While your situation may be true, it isn't the norm.

It's a victim mentality that blocks you from thinking otherwise. You cannot cognitively look at life from the perspective as a white person, because you're hard-wired this way based on your environment and past history.

I have shown you all the sources for what I have said. We aren't going to agree so let's move on.

I'm saying that I won't yield what I have for anybody. I earned it and don't feel that giving it up because another person doesn't have that, would be be pretty stupid. For example - you have a white person that worked hard all his life to build to what he has - are you saying that a black person who say, didn't work as hard, should be given a bigger break and give them all of what I have for free even though they're undeserving and didn't work hard the way I did - on the sake of equality?

This is a straw man that in order to achieve equality that we must take from one group and give it to the other as if success is a zero-sum game. I won't say anymore about this.

I'd prefer to revert to the real world on what I see everyday - as opposed to statistics that are just words. I could provide copious amounts of factual data which would suggest things - however I wouldn't want to be looked upon as a racist in doing so since I'm not.

I've demonstrated that a lot of what you see is not the norm. And this idea that if you gave information you would be called racist is a cop-out. What conclusions you come to based on the information you find is the key.

I lived in both easy and hard areas - in the hard areas, the black and white kids got along great and I didn't see any of this "racism" - in the easy areas - they still got along great, you are suppose to be a minority because you are a minority ! What will you say by 2050 when Hispanics are the majority population in America ? What then?

I don't know what you're saying here. Please explain.

If you get free- housing, I don't care where you live. You're getting it for free - as far as I'm concerned, it's my tax dollars that are paying for your lack of success. Theirs agencies set up to find people jobs - I'm not sure why minorities don't utilize them. Also blacks aren't the only ones in public housing - I've known of whites who were, and inside the apartment was pretty decent. When you go to an ATM at night, and looking over your shoulder. Are you more afraid of cops, or criminal gangtas ?

First, unless you are in prison, a shelter or a nursing home, you pay something for where you live. I don't know where you get this idea of free housing from, because public housing is funded based on income. Second, you assume that minorities aren't using job training programs when they have been predominately used by minorities since they were created.

I don't understand the point of your last question

Just because we had segregation then - doesn't mean it's what I'm referring to. I'm saying, how come the trends of modern day have dwindled down to such new lows - that everybody dresses and acts trashy? Media influence? Home influence? What is it ?? Looking at the pictures - They looked pretty healthy, successful, with gainful employment. Now you see the communities obese, unemployed, lazy and ignorant.

Your conformation bias is showing. You're saying what they looked like. I've told you that black people today have never been more wealthy nor more educated. Unemployment is higher today than it was decades ago, and well as obesity.

The more I read your responses the more I am getting a sense that you actually aren't listening or reading the sources I've linked. You seem to be comfortable with your opinions so I think I'll end this back and forth here.

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u/[deleted] Sep 06 '12

I do not know where you get your patience, but that was impressive. Wow.

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u/BlackSuperSonic Sep 06 '12

I'm a bit of a masochist. Lol