r/JewsOfConscience • u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi • Apr 23 '24
Discussion Being a Jewish Anti-Zionist feels exhausting.
First off, I’m an American and I am aware of exactly how much privilege that affords me.
But at the same time I feel like I’m fighting on all fronts - I’m fighting my own people, sometimes my own family, who cannot even bring themselves to acknowledge the crimes against humanity being committed. Heck even if I censor myself and my true feelings about Israel (that it was made as a monument to antisemitism, not a place to fight it) I’m a “traitor”
And then when there is actual antisemitism if I call it out, I get attacked for it and called a zionazi.
I am just so tired and worn out emotionally from all this. It feels like the group of people I can rely on or trust is very small.
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u/kaizoku-ni-naru Jewish Anti-Zionist Apr 23 '24
Absolutely agree, OP, speaking as another american anti-zionist jew. I made a very similar post about how isolating it felt on this sub, tho, and I received so many kind and supportive messages. There are a lot more of us than it seems sometimes <3
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
Hatred just feels so loud sometimes. But it’s good to know we’re here and we aren’t alone.
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u/desgoestoparis Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
Fellow Ashkenazi! You’re not alone! I struggle with the same feelings, but places like this sub really help.
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u/woofiegrrl Apr 23 '24
Another friend of mine said this to me recently, that there are more of us than it seems. But it just feels like everyone I know is zionist and I only connect with people like me in anonymous forums like this.
But still, I'm glad you're all here, my friends in my little computer box.
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u/Skryuska Apr 24 '24
Canadian anti-zionist Jew here as well. Hatred is definitely the loudest right now, and I had the privilege of mostly being exhausted and frustrated at worst, but standing up for people facing slaughter is still the right thing to do, so feeling a worn down is nothing by comparison. We’re all trying to right this wrong while being ignored, but to those that matter we are making a difference and can’t slow down.
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u/Being-of-Dasein Non-Jewish Ally Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24
Unfortunately, this is the price for taking a moral stand. The thing that keeps me going is that I want to be able to face myself in the mirror and be able to say that my principles matter. I could not abide being a moral coward, no matter how much simpler that would make living in this corrupt world.
In addressing you, and other Jewish people like you, personally, however, I would say your role is absolutely crucial to the anti-zionist movement. Without you, we would be labelled as anti-Semites as a way to delegitimise us. We need you. Solidarity in the struggle, comrade.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I have no intention of stopping. But I definitely needed a moment of mental peace to get my energy back.
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u/Being-of-Dasein Non-Jewish Ally Apr 23 '24
Good man. Wasn't suggesting you were thinking of stopping, just thought I'd share my thought process on it to help you contexualise why it's worth it to keep fighting.
You're not alone in this, but I won't pretend you, and people like you, don't have it the hardest. You have to fight your own people and family on this, something I have never had to do with my own people and family (Muslim). Please know that your sacrifice and moral conviction is not unrecognised, nor unappreciated—quite the opposite in fact! Your moral courage and other notable Jewish people, such as Dr. Finkelstein, are a source of constant inspiration. This sub is a shining example of the moral conviction and tradition that the Jewish people can uphold. You are the greatest ally to have in this struggle. Keep fighting the good fight.
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u/MassivePsychology862 Non-Jewish Ally Apr 24 '24 edited Apr 24 '24
Bless you. Take the time you need. I’m here as a non-Jewish ally. I’m Lebanese and I’m having the same struggles with some of my family members. It is exhausting.
Take your time. Recharge. We need strength to not only advocate for peace but to also confront those in our immediate circles. It’s one thing to protest. It’s an entirety different thing when it comes to engaging with family and friends.
This all takes a toll. Giving yourself space is so important. Allowing ourselves to burnout doesn’t do any good for anyone, including ourselves.
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u/BlackBey Apr 23 '24
I’m your Arab Muslim cousin, and I just want to say I sincerely appreciate and love you. Through our efforts, one day Zionism will disappear from the world and we will all live together in harmony and peace. This is what keeps me going.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
We have so much more in common than what we have that divides us.
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u/Lazy-Quantity5760 Apr 23 '24
Are you me? American anti Zionist Jew here feeling lonely af.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
My brother and I were talking about what’s happening at Columbia yesterday and it just sent me into a spiral. I don’t know what information to trust and that’s always so frustrating.
I’m fairly certain that that like most protests it’s like 99% peaceful with 1% agitators. But it’s still stressing me out.
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u/Launch_Zealot Arab/Armenian-American Ally Apr 23 '24
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u/justadubliner Apr 24 '24
Thank you for that link. I figured it was just the usual lies from the pro Zionists. It's heart warming to see so many people can transcend religious tribalism to recognise immoral practices by co-religionists. It is the only hope for the future of humanity.
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u/Lanfear_Eshonai Apr 23 '24
It must be difficult. Standing up against Zionists (your own people and even family as you say) and antisemitism. It does sound exhausting.
All I can say is you are doing good work and to stay strong. Not much I know, but that small group that you can rely on is essential in staying strong. I'm sure some of them are experiencing similar.
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u/zzpop10 Apr 23 '24
Here here comrade! The good fight is often a lonely fight.
While it’s pointless to argue with people online, when I have asked non-Jewish friends of mine who are very pro-Palestine to workshop how they phrase certain things I have felt that they listened to me and appreciated my input.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
Yeah. I try to talk more in person than online. Even on Facebook with people I know is hard. One time I just reposted something about the number of journalists killed by the IDF and my cousins latched onto the fact that the OP had “from the river to the sea” in their comment instead of addressing the actual issue and lectured me about how much “Hamas hates them”. Like… yes. And the more people Israel kills the more they’re going to hate you. That’s how cycles of violence work.
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u/zzpop10 Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24
Yeah, these are not fun times and it hits hardest when the tensions are within our own families. Sending you whatever positive energy I can!
Also, it’s just so annoying how obsessive people are over the “river to the sea” slogan. Every conversation is about that slogan. The entire thesis of the “antisemitism on campus” narrative rests entirely on the interpretation of that one slogan. It’s just become “the thing” for people to latch onto. And I’m not even like a big fan of that slogan or interested in defending its use against anyone who would criticize its use, not that I have a problem with it either. Slogans just don’t matter that much, that’s the point! People just repeat the slogans they hear other people saying at rallies and it mostly doesn’t go much deeper than that and we don’t need a federal investigation over it! It’s just so obviously bad faith when people try to reduce politics to a semantic gotcha game of “you said the bad word, conversation over, I win!” It reminds me when the right-wing were pretending that they would have been ok with the slogan “black lives matter, too” but because we didn’t include the “too” we were clearly saying that no other lives mattered. Right, sure. There is no winning these stupid semantic games. If the pro-Palestine protesters dropped the “river to the sea” slogan entirely then the people who want to find a reason to hate the protesters would just immediately move the goal posts and pick some other thing to latch onto as their new excuse to not engage in conversation.
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u/Launch_Zealot Arab/Armenian-American Ally Apr 24 '24
Can you share more about what you alluded to regarding how to phrase certain things? I’m not promising to adopt a particular phrasing but I’d at least like to know.
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u/zzpop10 Apr 24 '24 edited Apr 24 '24
I don’t remember all the exact details but basically I’ve helped give some of my non-Jewish friends better insight into what it’s like to go through Zionist indoctrination and how the mythology of Israel is so tied into to Jewish generational trauma and deep fear that we are always one inch from annihilation etc… One of my non-Jewish friends had said some really basic stuff about resistance to occupation and it had set off one of their other friends who is Jewish (and I assume Zionist) who then was accusing them of “supporting Hamas and the beheading of Jewish babies.” So this non-Jewish friend of mine didn’t want to loose their friendship with this other Jewish friend of theirs so I was helping them learn how to phrase anti-Zionism 101 in the softest and least scary terms so they could hopefully make some progress with this friend of theirs. As we all know so many Jews are trauma bonded to Zionism and they literally think anti-Zionism = “I wish none of you survived the Holocaust” so it just takes allot of emotional insight into that to begin to de-program people.
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u/Launch_Zealot Arab/Armenian-American Ally Apr 24 '24
Thank you for sharing that. I don’t frequently speak about politics with Jewish Zionists, but it’s good to know that I may need to tread carefully around sincere hypersensitivity.
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u/zzpop10 Apr 25 '24 edited Apr 25 '24
Another one I just remembered was a non-Jewish friend of mine who was sharing side by side pictures of IDF soldiers and Nazis. If you are trying to get through to a Jewish Zionist, I wouldn’t use that example, it’s just going to be triggering for them and will cause them to harden in their position. I think when de-programming someone it’s good to not focus on Israel at all. It’s not about Israel, it’s about the Palestinians. Zionist Jews want to have a conversation about Israel where you say “Israel is bad” and they say “Israel is good” and they come away feeling like they stood up for and defended this thing that is so central to their identity that it’s an extension of themselves. You want to push Israel out of the conversation and center things on the Palestinian story. Sure, they will try to victim blame the Palestinians. But if it is possible to de-program them then eventually their defenses will crack and they will have a moment of empathizing with the Palestinian story. With that said, allot of liberal Zionist Jews think they are empathetic to the Palestinians in the “oh it’s such a sad complicated situation was so many difficult part to it” type of way but what they have done is completely shut out all the details of the intentional cruelty Israel has committed. They see Israel as a victim of circumstance even in its own oppression of the Palestinians. “Israel doesn’t want to occupy, it doesn’t want to be at war, but it has to consider its own safety.” So it’s really important to just be armed with the facts that really showcase the specific intentional cruelty of Israeli policies on the lives of Palestinians.
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u/Launch_Zealot Arab/Armenian-American Ally Apr 25 '24
Thank you very much. I’ll keep that in mind.
There is a Zionist family within our outer circle of friends. They have a son who leans right and apparently spoke about joining the IDF. There’s a very small but nonzero chance that the topic may come up. What’s the best way to reach someone like that?
My gut feeling is to focus on how dehumanizing Palestinians is so normalized in the IDF that it would be very morally unhealthy to immerse yourself in that environment, particularly where you’re dealing with orders and peer pressure.
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u/Klutzy-Pool-1802 Ashkenazi, atheist, postZ Apr 24 '24
I’ve been scared to ask anyone to do anything because of some behavior I witnessed immediately after October 7th. Can you explain what things were phrased badly and what you suggested instead?
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u/tryingtokeepthefaith Middle Eastern Muslim Apr 23 '24
As an Arab Muslim, I just want you to know how much I appreciate you, and all Anti-Zionist Jews.
It’s certainly not easy, and all your efforts to fight for justice for all of humankind are truly to be commended.
In solidarity ✊🏽🇵🇸.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
And we see you. Never again means never again, for anyone.
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u/tryingtokeepthefaith Middle Eastern Muslim Apr 23 '24
Thank you so much. We see you too. And absolutely. Never ever again.
Mad love and respect! ✊🏽🇵🇸
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u/hingee Apr 23 '24
Right on it is exhausting
But you are fighting the good fight
You have right on your side and you opponent know this
Their plan is to exhaust you with lies, disinformation and bad faith arguments
Nothing worth anything isn’t worth fighting for
Palestinian children have no way of protecting themselves they’re relying on us
Chin up soldier
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u/monaqur Apr 23 '24
I love you for being a decent human being! I love you for standing up for those who can’t stand for themselves. I love you for being hurt by those who claim to love you, even though it hurts, you still stand for truth and justice. I love you. You are not alone.
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u/ThePaintedOgre Jewish Apr 23 '24
Have you ever heard of the International Jewish Labor Bund? Might be a good fit for you. Support and backup.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
In passing but I don’t know much about them. I should look into it.
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u/Balthazar_Gelt Apr 23 '24
It feels like the entire world is trying to drive us insane. Hang in there comrade
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u/Fun_Pension_2459 Apr 23 '24
I am 100% with you. There are members of my family who have made me doubt my own sanity. How did I know and love them for years and now they turn out to be the worst kind of people? My conclusion, as yours has been obviously, is to just connect with the right people and focus on what matters.
We have to all take strength from the fact that we are focused on our values and on humanism over bigotry and nationalism.
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u/DO_MD Palestinian Apr 23 '24
I can’t imagine how much bravery it takes to do what you’re doing. I’m a Christian Palestinian American and I have love for both my Muslim and Jewish brothers and sisters as things were in Palestine before Zionism. I hope you and I will see that world return
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u/Fun_Pension_2459 Apr 23 '24
Thank you for that reply. I remember years ago in Israel (where I grew up), I had the privilege to speak to a shopkeeper in East Jerusalem and he told me about his family having lived side by side with Jewish families for generations, and the devastation that followed the Naqba. Another generous Palestinian took me to see his home in Nablus which is occupied by settlers.
I left the country before I could be recruited into the military. I am slowly learning how much was withheld from me in terms of the history.
Sometimes I feel sorry for some of my Zionist family members, because they genuinely don't know anything and are terrified for their own future. What infuriates me, though, is their complete resistance to learning how they might be wrong, now that the information is so easily accessible online, and even more so how they can possibly justify the present murders of tens of thousands of Palestinians in Gaza. I don't get how that can ever be rationalized by anyone. Even for the most brainwashed, this should be a wake up moment.
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u/Aurhim Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I think it’s a combination of fear and moral exhaustion. A useful way I like to think about it is by comparing it to my own revulsion to Trump. The things he’s said are so beyond the pale of what I consider acceptable in a leader that I definitely gatekeep based on people’s takes on the man.
While I understand there are people who support or benefit from the policies his administration put in place, my sheer disgust of him makes those facts into non-sequiturs. He could cure cancer and invent cold fusion, but I’d still be ashamed to be his countryman.
For someone with a comparable disgust/distrust of Palestinian Arabs and a belief of the virtuousness of Israel and the Zionist cause, it’s easy to see how that ingrained thinking would color their viewpoint.
Given the ever-mounting visceral horror of this war and the many, many conflicts that came before it, it’s completely understandable that people would adopt a “fuck it, just burn it all down” attitude toward whichever group they have a more negative view toward. You see this on both sides of the conflict, from the Israelis and Jews who deny or play down the deaths of innocents and see nothing wrong with the settlements to Arabs and Pro-Palestinians who call for the mass killings of Jews or repeats of October 7th.
There are two kinds of people who refusal to self-educate: those who do not care to learn more, and those who cannot bear to learn more. The former hold that belief because they simply don’t care about the truth one way or the other. In that case, education really is a waste of time, because they wouldn’t listen in the first place. The latter group, however, does it simply out of self-preservation. The average person is not hard-hearted, not instinctually so, at any rate. For them, a closed mind is more or less necessary in order to keep themselves from being forced to reevaluate their deeply held beliefs. Vanishingly few people are okay with being “the bad guy”, and as a result, there is a naturally inclination among groups for them to shirk criticism and tailor their information intake to confirm with their prior biases.
One of our species’ most powerful instincts is our drive to maintain group cohesion and not rock the boat. The sad truth is that, when push comes to shove, when a person is forced to choose between the fealty to the truth and supporting their confederates, it’s a toss up as to which one they’ll pick.
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u/Kimmy-Goodman Apr 23 '24
I made this same exact post several months ago in a different sub, I’m so glad that someone feels the same way! This is truly an awful experience being so alone, being the one person in my family taking a stand. In the past 6 months I’ve come close to being cut off by my family for being a “terrorist” and an “anti-Semite”, no matter how many times I would force them to face the truth and they would listen, the next day they’d be back to watching Fox News and wanting Israel to win and donating to Zionist orgs. I feel completely powerless and like my efforts are completely wasted. I’ve nearly cut off my relationship with my twin brother who is the closest person to me, because I needed him to understand his culpability in spreading Zionist propaganda and how he was contributing to genocide. I’ve given up on my family, it’s hopeless, and every now and then a fight starts, I feel like I have no one, and then things die down, I’ve gotten used to it, but it’s draining as hell.
Fortunately I found a group on my college campus with whom I could channel my energy into actual organizing, actual efforts to drive material and ideological change, if even to the smallest degree. But I also have to lie to my family about this, and always take the risk of their lashing out should they find out about my activities, so it’s a precarious situation for sure.
God, this is so hard. I wish you luck and solidarity comrade!
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u/TheThirdDumpling Apr 23 '24
It is exhausting, nobody wanted this, we all want the world to be more peaceful and we can watch cat videos. But it isn't, we are exhausted because we are human with morality.
Maybe the immediate circle of friends you can rely on is small, but you have this community here. Rinse up and keep going. There are lives to save.
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u/drumdingus Apr 23 '24
i’m in my conversion process right now and my mikveh is in june, i’m getting horrified that i won’t be able to finish my conversion bc of how i feel.
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u/AcrobaticEngineer33 Anti-Zionist Ally Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 24 '24
Brother, as an Arab-American Muslim, I completely feel you because I call out antisemitism (more like anti-Judaism) among Arabs when I hear it, and they call me a zionist sympathizer and traitor.
Don't let their ignorance deter you from choosing justice.
People need to identify hate, especially when it comes from within, and we can only do that by tactfully calling it out in our own circles.
EDIT: grammar
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u/No_Caterpillar8026 Apr 23 '24
I’m really sorry you have to go through this and I’m grateful you’re still choosing to choose morals over an easier life!
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I can't not. And it hurts my head and heart to see why people can't see what we all see.
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u/Launch_Zealot Arab/Armenian-American Ally Apr 23 '24
Arab/Armenian cousin here. I’m very deeply grateful for you and saddened to hear what you’re going through.
If there’s something to take heart over, you are the true embodiment of “never again.”
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u/mfp242 Apr 24 '24
My parents are visiting me and my family for Pesach, and my dad refuses to ride in my car because of the several anti-zionist/pro-palestine bumper stickers I've got on there. I've always seen my parents (dad especially) as being exceedingly ethical, morally upstanding people, but their continued support of Israel (and the USs involvement with Israel) is incredibly painful for me. I firmly believe that they are on the wrong side of history with this, and it hurts to feel this disappointed in them.
Solidarity with my Jewish anti-zionist comrades, this is a tough spot to be in. Solidarity with my Palestinian cousins, please know that there are Jews all over the world who are fighting for your liberation. Love for the People Israel, and fuck the State of Israel.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 24 '24
Pesach Sameach, friend. This holiday, for me, has always been about standing with those facing their own oppression. We escaped ours, and we must pay it forward.
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u/Yanive_amaznive Apr 24 '24
I am an Israeli, i can't voice my opinions out of fear of destroying all my support systems and to be honest, I'm increasingly getting worried of legal consequences as well.
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u/Two_Word_Sentence Atheist Apr 23 '24
And then when there is actual antisemitism if I call it out, I get attacked for it and called a zionazi.
Who attacks you for that, and why??
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I forget what sub it was on but I got banned from it for saying Trump would not be better for Gaza than Biden
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u/sugar_rush_05 Apr 23 '24
I commend your strength on standing up, even when doing it is the hardest.
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u/vzvv Apr 23 '24
I’m in the same position and I agree, it’s like walking a tight rope. It’s necessary but exhausting.
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Apr 23 '24
It's difficult to see what's right when everyone around you believes that it's wrong. It's even more difficult to take stand against the wrong because that would mean potential conflict with those around you. People like these are rare in history, but they are the ones who have made history.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I feel like that’s a Captain America speech lol.
Doesn’t matter what the press says. Doesn’t matter what the politicians or the mobs say. Doesn’t matter if the whole country decides that something wrong is something right. This nation was founded on one principle above all else: the requirement that we stand up for what we believe, no matter the odds or the consequences. When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world — “No, you move.”
(I really like Captain America, and have a whole thing about him being a metaphorical golem)
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Apr 24 '24
Lol. Not my type of movie, but I love the speech that you shared.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 24 '24
It’s actually a quote from him in a Spider-Man comic - I fuckin love superhero comics and the entire industry was build by Jewish Americans in the 1930s and 40s. Captain America was created by Joe Simon and Jack Kirby (Jakob Kurtzberg) as a direct response to the US refusing to help European Jews.
Sorry I have a lot of feelings 😅
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u/lucash7 Non-Jewish Ally Apr 23 '24
Not Jewish, but I hear you. Just trying to spread basic, simple, yet profound things like compassion, empathy, justice, etc. seems so exhausting and unnecessarily complicated just with my own attempts. I can only imagine how it is for anyone Jewish, especially if/when you get called self hating.
Humans are weird sometimes. shrugs
Much love.
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u/trueBHR Jewish Apr 24 '24
Boy do we all get it, this has been a really tough time for all of us. I've been substantially luckier than many others in how my family has responded to the war, but that hasn't stopped me from feeling wracked with guilt and horrifically disguted by the atrocities occurring at this exact moment in the Gaza Strip, along with the pogrom that happened on October 7th. At the beginning of the war, my parents and I fundamentally disagreed with how it was occurring since they still felt strongly about Israel being the morally righteous side. But since then, they've admitted that they were wrong!!! It was more or less just a fleeting hope to hold onto their love for what Israel could be rather, and they believe it sometimes has been in the past, than what it is at the moment. I was so relieved to hear that, not just from my mom who was more open to it for a while since I've been telling her about a lot of the problems far before the Oct. 7th, but also my dad who had strong beliefs in support of Israel. They both still agree that Israel should have counterattacked on October 7th (something I disagree with), but they months ago started to completely recognize how horrible Israel's been acting in this war, along with a lot of the problems in the West Bank, and the original problems with the prison-like system in the Gaza Strip, AND some of the discriminatory laws in Israel! I also wrote an article a few weeks after October 7th directly against the war, Hamas and the Israeli government, begging the Israeli government not to start the ground invasion; quickly after I published the article, I went to see extended family, which I was kinda scared about. Some more good news though was that while there were a wide variety of opinions from my family, I was lucky to have a lot of my family members accept and agree with parts of my article, both parts criticizing Hamas and criticizing Israel. In fact, the most supportive of my critiques of Israel among my family was actually the only family member directly connected to the Holocaust, who agreed that Netanyahu is horrible and Israel has been acting pretty amorally; their biggest concern was for my safety after publishing the article, cause as they said, "the Jewish community isn't very kind to this type of talk, so be careful," and they're a man who wears the Star of David necklace daily :)
So I have been extremely lucky with my family, but due to being a masochist, I've still thrown myself towards the internet to talk to people from both sides of this war, and ended up in a lot of the online conversations like the ones you described above, so I totally get the feeling, and it's been extremely frustrating dealing with people who, just like every other discriminated against group deals with, only see me for the part I am discriminated for having. I don't know where you grew up, but from my experience, having grown up in a majority non-Jewish community, I got used to having to see the good intentions people can have within ignorance, and I'm sure you have some similar experience, but none of it makes it any easier to deal with. All I can say definitively is that you are absolutely valid, especially from a Jewish perspective: our religion is fundamentally based off of disagreements, and even outright rejecting God's words if we feel like it because we were given the free will to make that decision. As sad as it's been to have this war be the example in our lifetime, it's been the honor of my life to get to practice that very Jewish tradition with all of you. Also, I have to keep reminding myself that Jews were split about 50/50 in the United States on abolition and the civil rights movement, so for as many people in our community who are ignorant to the discrimination, suffering, rapes, and murders that Israel is either unintentionally or fully intentionally causing (based off of the problem), there has historically usually been another person with their heart in the right place, trying to take steps towards a better future. Pat yourself on the back, you deserve to feel proud of what you've been accomplishing. Even if I were to be completely against your arguments about Israel, if we were related, I'd still be proud that you've been following your moral code, no matter how people respond to it. Stay safe out there, and good luck :)
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u/xGentian_violet Non-Jewish Atheist, Anti-Zionist Apr 23 '24
it's tiring to any kind of committed anti-zionist tbh, in october i made a post where i said i had to a short break from the one sided coverage because i felt like my head was going to crack open
but im sure getting abandoned by your community like if your entire family and community are zionist i.e. genocide supporters adds another element of trauma to it.
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u/ray-the-they Ashkenazi Apr 23 '24
I’m lucky that it’s not my immediate family - but I have cousins who are Israeli and now live in the states and it’s just impossible to talk to them.
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u/xGentian_violet Non-Jewish Atheist, Anti-Zionist Apr 23 '24
i have ustashe sympatising family members (croatian fascists, did the Holocaust), so i relate. Being a gay leftist woman i dont even talk to them, maybe once every few years
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u/xGentian_violet Non-Jewish Atheist, Anti-Zionist Apr 23 '24
btw, when you do the right thing generally you have to try to find your own family in a way, to serve as an additional support mechanism, in ideogically aligned people, because a lot of people's birth family support various horrible things, and you will very feel isolated otherwise
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u/BolesCW Mizrahi Apr 24 '24
Sepharadi American anti-zionist here. I cannot talk to anyone at services, and since my mother (who started to question her zionist upbringing in her 60s) died I cannot talk to anyone in my family. I have two close friends who are non-zionist Jews, and that's as close as I get to a community of like-minded folks.
I've studied way too much of the history of Jew-hatred to ignore the easy reliance of non-Jewish -- and sometimes Jewish -- anti-zionists on antisemitic tropes (Israel controls US foreign policy, Israeli soldiers and settlers take special [ie, Jewish] pleasure in killing babies, Jews living outside Israel are more loyal to Israel then their home countries...), and when I call it out I'm called a zionist apologist/sympathizer -- you know, because I'm a Jew after all...
You're right: it's exhausting. But I am very heartened to read all these comments! I don't know how much it might help you (if at all), but I always keep in mind what is written in Pirkei Abhoth: you are not required to finish the work, but neither are you free to desist.
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u/wannaberebelll Apr 24 '24
to start, happy passover! i hope you can still celebrate even if you’re feeling a bit drained and at the end of your rope.
i can’t imagine how you must feel, being outcasted by your own and ridiculed by the people you’re defending.
i’m muslim and i sometimes lurk this sub without joining since i want this to be a space to amplify jewish voices but please know you’re appreciated and i’d like to think most of us DO NOT stand for bigotry or antisemitism.
it’s hard, but try to not take garbage insults like that to heart. if you feel like what you’re standing for is right, that’s all that matters.
i hope you have a wonderful passover and remember that you are NOT a self hating jew.
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u/SexAndSensibility Jewish Apr 24 '24
I feel you a lot. Last week at the JCC I go to weekly an antisemite waving a gun got arrested. This is the third time since 10/7 this has happened. That said, the community and my family are thoroughly Zionist and it’s frustrating to fight them and anti Semitism at once.
I’m lucky that my wife feels the same way. She wasn’t Jewish when I met her but converted a few years after we met. The rabbi and synagogue were Zionist but there was no brainwashing like I experienced when I grew up. She’s been Jewish a few years but doesn’t know a whole lot about Israel or Zionism. She doesn’t understand how anyone can support Israel now.
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u/AH_Sam Israeli for One State Aug 11 '24
As an anti-Zionist Jew in Israel, I feel ya. I have about 2 close friends I can talk freely with about this topic.
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u/echtemendel Jewish Communist Aug 11 '24
היי, אני לא יודע עד כמה את/ה מכיר עוד אנטי-ציונים, אבל אם את/ה רוצה להכיר עוד - שלח/י לי הודעה, אני יכול לנסות לחבר אותך עם חבר'ה שעדיין גרים שם.
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u/Drakeytown Apr 23 '24
It's good to know that there are Jewish people who see the antisemitism inherent in the colonialist project--if there is one safe place in the world for Jews, then nobody's working on making the rest of the world safe for all marginalized people! If there's one place in the world where all Jews have a right to go, then that's where every antisemitic country in the world will send them!
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u/publicpersuasion Apr 23 '24
Be anti revisionst zionist. I do t see why Israel and Palestine can't Co exist and both sides treat the past like Germany does the Holocaust. Anyone who steps out of line is punished harshly.
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u/Person306 Apr 23 '24
Why should Palestinians be confined to a state on 22% of their land? Palestinians should have the right to live freely in all of Historic Palestine. Israelis should have the same rights, to live freely in all of Historic Palestine as equal citizens - just as Yasser Arafat and the PLO proposed 50 years ago. One democratic, secular state for all.
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u/publicpersuasion Apr 23 '24
I do not see why you attributed this aspect to my comment. The problem is democracy is driven by numbers. The two religions will gang up voting to win and it'll destabilize both sides. The same way the duopoly of America is ruining America. You need to tie the economic success together, while keeping the beaurocratic things separate. Unfortunately, religion isn't peaceful, but money is. Make the economies Codependent and you'll see the extremist fall in line.
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u/eitzhaimHi Jewish Apr 23 '24
Yes, it is exhausting. You get to make space to feel it. And, yes, you are not alone. If Not Now is hosting liberation seders all over the country. Maybe you can find one near you or one where you can Zoom in? It makes such a difference to be among Jews who see the world in the same way.
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u/Quirky_Training_8642 Apr 25 '24
I wish I could cut out a piece of my heart and give it to you. I couldn’t imagine your exhaustion. I admire your empathy
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u/ganjaPaani Apr 27 '24
Thank you for being on the right side of humanity. Your demographic is the most important in this immensely important cause. Stay strong and keep on! Much love and respect.
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u/SirNurtle May 02 '24
I can't say I can relate fully, but I am half Russian (Moms Russian, dads mixed race and I look very Caucasian so many just say that I am Russian) yet am also vehemently anti-Putin and as a result I received alot of hate/criticism, I am either seen as a westoid propagandist or just recieve hate because I'm half Russian, and Russia is big bad.
Keep on what you are doing, during times like these you have extremists on both sides who try and paint/pin all the blame on the other side(?), in this case there are sadly many Pro Palestinian supporters I have seen that are extremely anti Semitic and use Israel's actions as a way to say that all Jews are evil.
But try and take a break every now and then, keep your chin up and try whatever you can, it may not change much sadly but you can make your voice known and more importantly, inform your average Joe that not all Jews support Israel and that there are infact many Jews that are Anti-Zionist
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u/neemo2357 Apr 23 '24
FWIW Ive never met you but youre my brother in humanity
Justice is universal. Please dont feel isolated.