Most conservatives will pretty such say that only ATF cops are bastards. The rest will say ATF bad but the cops are blameless, just following orders, etc.
Right-wingers instantly turn ACAB when you mention the ATF; the only reason anyone to the right of Reagan doesn't unanimously oppose police is because they haven't connected the dots that it's all their "thin blue line" buddies that are going to take away their guns and (theoretically) put them in FEMA camps.
Calmly explain to them to reality of their circumstances using the ATF, and their shameless harassment of middle-class goobers--because real criminals are scary, as mutual ground to discuss "reasonable" or "common-sense" reforms to law enforcement😉
ATF shouldn't exist; FBI shodnt exist. The best argument for "no cops" or "defund the police" is they can't be trusted with weapons and normal people need to be allowed to defend themselves.
This is literally the argument all concern trolls use but I'll engage on the off chance you're legit.
Police don't solve crimes; people solve crimes; the reality of your presupposition is false considering people lived, and solved crimes, before modern policing.
What everyone means when they say they want to get rid of police is "British-style public security".
We all want the people enforcing our laws to be subject to it; no more paid vacations for brutalizing and menacing the public.
We want our laws to reflect community values; no more federal/state "princes" dictating how we should live and relate to each other.
We want law enforcement by the community, for the community; no more out of town cops showing up to beat people for a paycheck.
And as for the FBI. You're premise presupposes those people would NEVER be caught without them; which is silly when trafficking cases closed make up a minority of cases relative to those unsolved.
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u/Longjumping_Visit718 3d ago
Remind them the ATF shouldn't exist.