r/antiwork • u/Doomstone330 • Nov 14 '24
Rant đĄđą Just saw my role posted on ZipRecruiter for between $10,000-$20,000 more per year than I make
Was hired in at $70k/year. I'm expected to work overtime (I don't), and our benefits are honestly kinda crap. I just got a job alert for the role (there are 5 of us in this role, we're trying to fill 2 positions).
The new job posting says job starts at $80-$90,000 per year. What are my options here? Do I show this to management and ask for a raise? Bring it up in a review? I'm pretty disgusted, especially with the way they've been treating the staff (hence why 2 people are no longer working there now)
I'm in USA.
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u/Agent-c1983 Nov 14 '24
Submit your resume.
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u/Doomstone330 Nov 14 '24
I actually thought about it lol
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u/tuvar_hiede Nov 15 '24
Do this and then refer yourself to H.R. as the perfect candidate who's already trained.
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u/AndyDufresneDidIt Nov 15 '24
Get that referral bonus!
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u/AndyDufresneDidIt Nov 15 '24
Don't forget to request PTO so you can take the day off to go to your interview.
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u/ComprehensiveWar6577 Nov 15 '24
Even better if you are someone who doesn't go by a full legal name day to day (eg. Chris/Christopher, or go by a middle name)
Don't lie, but use the opposite of anything and see if you extran interview.
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u/OGMcgriddles Nov 15 '24
Makes sense to just do it. Get the job then use ur as leverage for the raise, if they don't give it, new job.
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u/mushy_orange Nov 15 '24
lol read the post again. The job is the same one he currently has (at the same company)
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u/OGMcgriddles Nov 15 '24
well in that case I would still be applying.
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u/Spare-Ring6053 Nov 15 '24
"Hi, I'm here to apply for the pay raise- I mean job, yeah this is absolutely a job I don't have now, what a strange thing I just said, sorry, I get really nervous at interviews....."
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u/Marsnineteen75 Nov 15 '24
This happened at my company and i had to fight to get the same pay as a new person I had to train making about 20,000 more than me And again I trained them It took a year and a half for me to get them to match The salary. I actually applied for the job that they posted and was told I was already hired talent and they were trying to recruit new talent And that when I was hired that was the going rate
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u/Cultural_Double_422 Nov 15 '24
If the going rate is now 20k higher, you're still underpaid by 20k.
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u/Marsnineteen75 Nov 15 '24
Yes they eventually adjusted it cuz they had to because it was policy but my leadership was so toxic they tried to find ways to prove me wrong and not pay me still. I had to go to the director who who my leadership was telling me was the one making the decision not to promote me but when I talk to the director he said he had no idea of it and chewed their asses and I got my promotion within weeks. I've actually called out the Chiefs bullshit in meetings and so now he targets me I'm going through the same thing right now, because I got a promotion and I'm not being given the respect and privileges due to the promotion as manager now. They literally gave me a promotion in title only but still have me doing the same duties as before but the issue with that is now I still have to manage on top of that while the rest of the managers are given a different schedule to have time for management. Pretty sure it has a lot to do with me reporting the person last time so I don't know what they're thinking because obviously they know I ain't going to play games and I will take it up the chain. I'm writing a letter to the director as we speak again.
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u/EmployerUpstairs8044 Nov 15 '24
Time to move on
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u/Marsnineteen75 Nov 15 '24
Easy to say when, but I got 3 kids it is good benes and retirement plan which is rare now.
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u/PetrichorMoodFluid Nov 15 '24
Exactly... Can always upgrade when you have a good setup. But it'll give you bargaining power if you have better offers and they are going to have to "try to convince you to stay" by "making it worth your while. I hear people getting better salaries and bonuses by doing that or just not remaining totally loyal to only one company and then they have more freedom to "move about the cabin" so to speak. ALWAYS make more leverage for yourself. Once they realize you are complacent is when they'll make you do the work of 3 people for no raise or upgrades to your living situation/benefits. We are just numbers to companies. We should treat them the same.
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u/SkoolBoi19 Nov 15 '24
Might want to submit a couple resumes to a couple places. Not sure why I have that feeling but your statement about being expected to work overtime and not, makes me think thatâs your position
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u/AtlanticFarmland Nov 15 '24
Submit your resume with your initials. EXAMPLE, If your name is Patrick John Smith, use P.J. Smith. And answer the /different/ phone as "PJ speaking" have fun and good luck
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u/vatothe0 Nov 16 '24
Put a slightly different name on it. Your name is Steve? New guys name is Steven or Sven.
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u/Mycroft-Holmes_IV Nov 15 '24
This 100%.
Highly skilled RNs often do this; give two weeks notice AND apply for the 'new' position on the same day.
The labor pool for highly skilled RNs is so tight and so competitive that this strategy seems to work for them. They can literally go across the street for more money and a sign-on bonus.
It's cost-effective for the employer because they are retaining a known-to-be competent and effective employee, and avoiding recruiting/onboarding cost and delay.
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u/Jay_OA Nov 16 '24
Thatâs wild I never thought about that. I am an RN in CA and we are mostly all unionized, so quitting and reapplying will not get you a raise. You can look up anyoneâs hourly wage in a table according to their years of service.
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u/laurasaurus5 Nov 15 '24
And submit a bunch of shitty fake resumes to make yourself look the best!
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u/Delusioned22 Nov 14 '24
They will not do anything and basically call your bluff until you leave. If you do bring it up they will find reasons to fire you.
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u/ReverseThreadWingNut Nov 15 '24
Sadly, this is how it will likely end. Start looking for a new job and leave 'em hanging. When they inevitably ask why, show them the job posting.
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u/Delusioned22 Nov 15 '24
Yes sir it is sad. I've seen it happen before. Make sure to leave on your terms and at least you know what you can easily get going anywhere else.
OP Good luck on your upgrade!
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u/2020_MadeMeDoIt Nov 15 '24 edited Nov 15 '24
I agree with, that this is most likely how it is. Because one of my previous companies did this to so many people.
But it's so stupid. It costs extra for companies to hire new employees (there's a lot of behind the scenes costs relating to setting up contracts and other jazz).
So it annoys me when companies won't give a current employee a raise and are willing to let them go, just to bring in someone new at that same salary as the raise.
And, as well as the extra cost, they'll have to spend time and money training the new person, meaning productivity will be down until they get up to speed. It's so stupid. đ€Š
ETA: My current company is (thankfully) almost the opposite. They go out of their way to try and keep staff. They learned early on how much extra it can cost when staff turns over regularly.
My onboarding took literally 3 months (this was normal and expected) and one time a conversation came up about how they like to keep staff.
My boss said: "You know how long it takes to onboard people. Why would we want to keep doing that over and over when we can just keep people who already know what they're doing?!" Lol.
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u/ManchmalHumanistisch Nov 14 '24
I wouldn't bring it up unless you've got a fallback position option.
You should definitely apply for the job and, if questioned, feign ignorance that you thought it was a new position that's similar but pays more.
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u/mcdonald_the_donald Nov 15 '24
Absolutely this đ Never show your cards until you have another offer in hand.
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u/c00lbeanz96 Nov 15 '24
Is the job posting vague enough that you could feign naivety and email the higher ups and say âhey, I saw there is an open position in our company that seems to be for a more senior role, I was wondering if you guys are looking to promote internally for it? If so Iâd like to be considered.â Maybe that would make them catch your drift lol. Or does everyone there know that you should know itâs for your current role?
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u/freakwent Nov 15 '24
OP is one of the people involved in the hiring process.
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u/c00lbeanz96 Nov 15 '24
Where did you gather that from?
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u/freakwent Nov 15 '24
"We are trying to hire two more people" and I thought the alert was from their recruitment software, I see now I misread that.
Sorry!
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u/djle12 Nov 15 '24
Only really one way to handle it.
That us to start looking for another job. When you do find one. When you do find one, do not quit. Call in sick for old job the first day of the new job. When thi gs look as expected with new job, quit old job without notice.
Doing it any other way, odds are you lose.
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u/Pitiful_Car2828 Nov 15 '24
I was a head chef at a restaurant who was having a hard time hiring cooks. I told him my buddy would work here but he wants more than me (then I proceeded to chuckle.). He dead ass said ok hire him. I quit a few weeks later.
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u/Firm-Raspberry9181 Nov 15 '24
This happened to me. I had been asking for a raise to meet the market rate for a few months, as we were short staffed and I was working harder than usual. They offered a candidate 20% more than my salary. I found out when he called me to discuss the job offer, and he asked about the salary not realizing I made less. My boss still refused the raise! I quit.
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u/xboxchick311 Nov 15 '24
This is the reason people change jobs every 2-3 years, unless they're getting substantial promotions. When you're in the same role for a long period of time, salary compression kicks in and new hires will make more than you. It's time for you to be the new hire somewhere else.
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u/mrsmedistorm Nov 15 '24
I had this exact situation happen to me. I went to my boss and asked for a 30% raise to bring me up to the job posting. I ended up getting 22%. My boss didn't even know what the job posting had said.
My boss told me to make a list of my current responsibilities vs when I was hired. He also suggested to make sure you put in writing on that list the raise you want. He was the first boss I had that actually told me I was good at something. He was one of the few good ones.
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u/luv4wheel Nov 15 '24
I was in this boat. Applied. Was told the range listed was a mistake. Resigned 2 weeks later. Management was like âwhy you leavingâ
After I left our department got a 20% raise all around. Companies are idiots
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u/Mycroft-Holmes_IV Nov 15 '24
MBAs tend to see numbers on a spreadsheet and view EEs as 100% fungible. Even if HR sees the need to rebalance existing salaries to market rate, the CFO is likely to pitch a fit and block it.
And the revolving door continues to spin lol.
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u/Brains_El_Heck Nov 15 '24
Iâm not saying calm down. Stay mad! But, Iâve replied to recruiters who were given outright falsified info from employers. It seems more and more typical to advertise âtotal expected compensationâ rather than base. Itâs likely theyâre adding your $70k base + OT.
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u/Garrden Nov 15 '24
SLEAZY. If they are already screwing with my money before I even started, at a point where they still have to attract me, what will happen when I become dependent on them?Â
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u/paintrain10 Nov 15 '24
This should be higher. OP said it himself that there is ot, he just doesn't take it. I don't think this practice should be legal but I'm not the government. State the base pay with the expectation that there will be a rough number of overtime hours per week/paycheck.
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u/Frozen_Regret Nov 14 '24
don't listen to these idiot commenters, unless your position is critical you have no bargaining power and are only putting a target on your back if you apply. Kf anything, apply to other positions and get your raise that way, if you can find something in this market.
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u/Whole_Mechanic_8143 Nov 15 '24
Start applying for jobs and move on. It's clear evidence you're underpaid where you are and even if they were to match it after you bring it up, do you really want to have to keep fighting to be paid on par with every new hire?
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u/Jazzhands__- Nov 15 '24
Youâre only worth as much as a worker as people are willing to pay for you. And this proves people are willing to pay more for you than you earn. Please make the case for your raise
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u/ItsOkILoveYouMYbb Nov 15 '24
Companies are forced to compete with the market when hiring. They're not forced to compete with any market when retaining, especially particularly for individual contributor roles.
This is why the only way to get substantial raises that compete with market rates is to leave your company for another that is doing the same thing, and being prepared to leave that company to realign to the market again. Rinse and repeat.
The only time this ever changes is if you have significant equity in the company and your presence is crucial to the company being profitable at all. You may have some temporary sway and success if you exist in a crucial knowledge silo and are willing to call bluffs and willing to quit the job, though.
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u/SpliTTMark Nov 15 '24
I tried this at my last job when i found out my coworker was making 4k more
They said "not in the budget"
Good luck
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u/TelephoneNo3640 Nov 15 '24
Itâs pretty well known that companies are always willing to pay more for new hires than to retain current employees.
A couple years ago I was promoted to the top position in my department. My boss went so far as to draw a diagram showing the pay range for my new position and put an X at the very highest end of the graph to say I was going to be making the most possible for that position. Well, with my new position I was now able to see the wages of everyone in my department as I was now their superior and in charge of things like performance reviews and raises. Surprise to me that the newest hire in the department who now worked for me was hired in at exactly the same wage I was told was the highest possible for my leadership position. Of course the big boss was reassigned to a different location within weeks of my promotion so I wasnât able to call him out.
Iâve since been given a bit of a bump so I am making more than the people under me but not by much.
I dream of leaving my job and being better compensated but Iâve been there for 20 years. Started at the very bottom and now hold a respected leadership position. My work is very technical and 99% of the time someone with my title holds advanced degrees and education. Because of this I feel my likelihood of finding comparable employment is unlikely. The only thing on my resume is my 20 years with this company. Iâm great at what I do and frankly kind of irreplaceable due to my proprietary knowledge and skills. Unfortunately none of that matters to other employers. I have tried a few times and canât even land an interview without the technical education and degrees listed on my resume.
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u/mybreakfastiscold Nov 15 '24
Apply. Do it. If they ignore it, go to HR and them you want an interview. They will say no. Ask them why. Push the issue.
Also apply to other places because its possible theyre looking for your replacement.
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u/Accomplished-Ad3250 Nov 15 '24
Get an offer for another comparable job and ask them to give you the $80k.
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u/Level_Investigator_1 Nov 15 '24
I have hired a lot of people and have had to revise pay scales in order to meet needs. If you want real advice - DM me. What you should do depends on industry, role, and how well you are viewed in the team.
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u/Exact_Programmer_658 Nov 15 '24
Yeah, you can't listen to them. They are worse than eBay. They tell janitors they should make a living wage. They tell ppl flipping burgers up to 10 hours a day they deserve a decent life. It's all nonsense.
Sincerely your boss.
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u/official_binchicken Nov 15 '24
Ziiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiip.....RECRUITahhhhhhhhhhh.
Sorry. I had to do ir. I always hear Bill Burr when I see Zip recruiter.
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u/Olfa_2024 Nov 15 '24
In all honestly their job offer to the candidate will be $10-20k less than the add says.
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u/Expert_Swan_7904 Nov 15 '24
i would apply to that position and then start applying at other companies with similar pay.
they either give you a raise or ignore you..and if they ignore you i would request a raise after you get a job offer somewhere else
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u/Contemplating_Prison Nov 15 '24
Did they not being your salary up to meet those? Thats kind of fucked.
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u/Chris_MCMLXXXVII Nov 15 '24
Your colleagues pay also probably differs from yours. If you're able to talk about salary with them, and find your all getting paid differently for doing the same job, then you might want to consider collectively bargaining. Maybe even form a union. Who knows what you'll be able to negotiate for, but I bet it's higher together than alone.
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u/MapFamiliar4062 Nov 15 '24
Amazing how the budget for new hires always exceeds the budget for raises.
I'd demand the same pay and make plans to leave if they stiff you.
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u/Christen0526 Nov 15 '24
I can understand how you feel.
I often put myself in those hypothetical situations.... like finding your job listed on a job site, and how I would react.
Also keep in mind, it's been days companies post jobs, with zero intention of hiring, as they've got people in mind already. But they've got make it look as though they're following employment to all, if that makes sense.
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u/Thatguy468 Nov 15 '24
Use that new pay range and your current experience to leverage a new job at a new company. If your company is offering that much, chances are that others are too.
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u/SteelTownHero Nov 15 '24
My wife is in the steelworkers union as a secretary. But, she's been there for two decades, so she makes more than anyone in the office, by far. So, this year, she told everybody because she doesn't think it's fair that she makes so much more than everyone. They were able to get everyone else in the office (non management, of course) up to her salary. And, to her surprise, her boss gave her a raise too, so she still makes the most.
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u/butterynipz Nov 15 '24 edited Nov 15 '24
Your current job is more valuable in an open job market. Once you agreed to the original job offer, you got locked in. Really the only way to break out of that range is to see what the market values the job at currently and go for that! (With another company)
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u/RationalDelusion Nov 15 '24
Letâs be honest.
They are going to offer that to try and get the most experienced people to apply but then work their way down from that pay rate.
They always do that. (Unless it the ownerâs relative or personal friend being referred to the jobs).
They rarely just offer to pay the top of what was advertised.
Just like used car sales people.
They lie and list a car for a great price, knowing in reality they have no intention of selling at that price, just to get people to show up.
Then they will take the desperate person who will settle for the real offer in the spot.
Same exact thing here.
So I would be careful in applying for your own job cause it would hint to your boss and HR you are looking and give away your hand in negotiation.
Just walk in there and make your case to your boss for why you should get a raise.
Go in there explaining what else you will take on to justify the extra pay etc.
If they turn you down then they should not be surprised when you go find better pay in another job etc.
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u/Sarge75 Nov 15 '24
Just because it states 80-90 doesn't mean they are gonna pay it. Just look at the number of posts in here where people say the listed said 100k and they were offered 60K.
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u/ITguy333 Nov 15 '24
They might be estimating OT as part of the salary too. Not that that is right but job postings have had worse.
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u/Calm-Paramedic-1920 Nov 15 '24
A prior company I worked for pulled this same bullshit. Guy got hired for around $10k more than me, same position. I remained coy and asked my manager about a potential raise. After I was given 1% more, I applied for and had a new job within a month, making almost $20k more.
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u/Tasty_Plate_5188 Nov 15 '24
Apply for the role via ZipRecruiter or Talk to HR about the wage discrepancy.
And while you're doing both of these things, get your resume in order and put it out there to work at another company. That way, if your company does not budge on your current pay, you have options.
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u/LovelyThoughtz Nov 15 '24
I would actually apply so they could see you...maybe they'll address it.
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u/youareceo Nov 15 '24
I once found my position posted on Indeed.
I'm the only position in my company of this.
Fuck them.
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u/Impressive_Reply7912 Nov 15 '24
Get a higher paying job SET before challenging the salary....And if you are happy there: bring it up. Otherwise ..... DEUCES! (sorry..I got grit with these topics)đ
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u/nopedy-dopedy Nov 15 '24
So you're expected to work overtime, but you don't so you make 70k a year.
If a new hire works overtime, they could make 10-20k more than you.
If the new hire also refuses to work overtime then they will also only make 70k.
I'm not trying to fight you... just considering the facts here.
I think it's a stupid way to list pay, but employers do this all the time. They factor overtime hours into your potential earnings. In my opinion the pay listed should be based on regular time only. Good luck telling that to the boss though.
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u/nickybecooler Nov 15 '24
Employers notoriously advertise salary ranges that are higher than what they are actually offering.
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u/20InMyHead Nov 15 '24
A job posting with a claim of a starting salary isnât a binding agreement. They can just as easily gaslight candidates and lowball them.
However, it can be fuel to take to your boss and ask for a raise. You might not get it, but your workplace seems pretty toxic, so moving on after they reject a raise might be your best move.
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u/inquisitiveeyebc Nov 15 '24
Seen that often, they won't start people at those wages, it's a ploy to get people to apply
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u/Morrigoon Nov 16 '24
I think Iâd request a raise, let them tell you they canât afford it, then produce the job listing and say, I believe this says that you do, or if this is a different job than mine, then Iâd like to be considered for that role please.
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u/slappy_mc_fappington Nov 16 '24
Damn, is the US really that cut throat. I'm reading all these comments to the tune of you've got to calculate your reaction versus your job security and other options. Here in UK if it came to light someone was getting paid more than others for the same role that's not banded there would be hell on.... Even more so if it's a unionised
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u/spacecampcadet Nov 16 '24
This happened at my husbandâs old work so a few of them got together and submitted their resumes for the new roles.
The business admitted to the current staff of was just a ploy to get a bigger pool of applicants and they would lowball them once they had them on the hook.
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u/iprobablybrokeit Nov 16 '24
Your best bet is to apply to other companies, interview, and negotiate a higher salary. If you get an offer for more, ask for a day or two to discuss with your partner. Take that to your current boss and tell them that you have X number of hours to make a decision and ask if they can match it.
Either they will, or you will have a new job paying more.
Remember though, the job market fluxes with supply and demand. If there's a high demand, the applicants and employees have a stronger position to negotiate from. You should be able to get an offer if you market yourself well. This is a double edge blade though, if the demand drops since time after, you may find yourself on the wrong end of a layoff if they can justify hiring lower cost labor. If you worry about this, be sure to put some of that extra pay back to help during your unemployment vacation.
As always, good luck!
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u/Mysterious-Meat7712 Nov 17 '24
I was making 80k in a previous role. I was one of the higher earners/performers. Most of the other guys I worked with were closer to 60-70k. After I left they posted a POTENTIAL 100-110k. No one even came CLOSE to that the entire time I worked there.
I was a service electrician. We were required to quote and complete all work. If a work order didnât sell, we didnât get paid for the time we were on site. Only got paid for the work that was completed and paid for.
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u/CaliFullerton Nov 17 '24
When I applied for a job, all I got back was an email from an Indian guy trying to ask me to apply for his contract gig that is nowhere what I applied for.
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u/Infamous_Rest_5226 Nov 18 '24
Do you work in an at-will state? If so, they can fire you for no reason. I suggest start working on your resume'. I had a job a 1.5 year ago that tried that with me. I leveled up with a new & left that job before they could fire. I work in an at-will state. Don't get mad. Get a new job.
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u/SockInteresting3820 Nov 15 '24
Did you ever consider the that extra pay is from the overtime they expect you to work?
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u/CommunistRingworld Nov 15 '24 edited Nov 15 '24
Submit your résumé under a pseudonym. If they refuse to give you the job when you reveal who you are, sue.
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u/againsterik Nov 15 '24
Sue the company after you falsified information on a resume? Good luck on that one.
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u/CommunistRingworld Nov 15 '24
Submitting your résumé under a yte sounding name to later sue them when it proves the same cv submitted under an ethnic name was treated differently, has been used in court to win racism claims. Lying about your name cause you think they're breaking the law, does not in any way hurt you in court.
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u/againsterik Nov 15 '24
Offering a position at a salary higher than what current employees make is not illegal (scummy and sadly common but no law says that you need to have new hires at same or lower wages). What you are suggesting is wildly different and you would need to prove in a court of law, that this pseudonym is something that you use as a common name and that this position that you applied for externally (as an already internal employee) is discriminating based on race.
Good luck on a 70k a year salary affording a lawyer who would even have the chops to try and prove something like that in court.
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u/CommunistRingworld Nov 15 '24
No actually. Turning down an application because you already have the person on the same job at a lower salary and not because of the merit is illegal. It proves special treatment. Any form of special treatment, even negative, is illegal. Applying under a pseudonym is a well accepted and legal way of proving the employer is acting illegally and arbitrarily targeting you. Just because mostly that's used to prove racism, does not mean it can't be used here.
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u/ISoNoU Left Libertarian Nov 15 '24
Jobs are for losers.
Read every post above. No matter what side of the political spectrum they are on, they're all going to tell you that you're powerless.
And they're not wrong.
Only losers take jobs.
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u/ExaminationSerious67 Nov 15 '24
Honestly, they are probably posting that range so they can attract people, they will select the top 3 and lowball them.