I have some ideas for new Jewish antifascist imagery

[u/daloypolitsey]

[u/daloypolitsey]

I would really like to add some Hebrew to it so it can be obviously Jewish, but don't know what to put and would love suggestions for that too

[u/edamamecheesecake → u/daloypolitsey]

Just don't do it backwards like the JVP in LA did 😭

[u/TheBastardOlomouc → u/edamamecheesecake]

Wait they did what

[u/BolesCW → u/[deleted]]

yep, backwards Hebrew, like all those tattoo mistakes. for seder plates, it's not as if there's a shortage of images to copy...
this really cements in my mind how JVP are, despite (or because of) their best intentions, the secular version of NK.

[u/Terpcheeserosin → u/BolesCW]

What is NK?

[u/BolesCW → u/Terpcheeserosin]

Neturei Karta

[u/[deleted] → u/daloypolitsey]

Or Yiddish.

[u/Am_i_the_Twisted_0n3 → u/[deleted]]

Good idea! My take:

[u/BolesCW → u/[deleted]]

there was no Yiddish in my home, there are no feelings of nostalgia attached to it, it is presumptuous to decide that it is the most normal vernacular for Jews. Ashkenormativity is so unnoticed. no thanks.

[u/[deleted] → u/BolesCW]

Yiddish is only one jewish language and not representative the diversity of Jewish cultures and ethnicities. It would be ideal if the symbol included multiple jewish languages including Yiddish, Ladino and Hebrew. With that being said, I do think that Yiddish has leftist significance. Yiddish was the language of the Jewish Labor Bund, a diasporic, anti-zionist, socialist movement. It is also a part of Jewish culture that was widely wiped out because of the holocaust. Its destruction is a continued legacy of and success for nazism to this day. For that reason I consider reviving Yiddish as an act of antifascism and against antisemitism.

[u/BolesCW → u/[deleted]]

reaching 🙄

[u/danabonfield02 → u/BolesCW]

as an ashki i agree

[u/yellow_parenti → u/BolesCW]

Yiddish makes the most sense in an anti-Zionist context imo, given that Anti-Yiddishism was official policy of Israel for a while. At the end of the day, we're just discussing an idea for what amounts to a meme representing a political/ideological movement. If you have a language that you feel more connected to, feel free to use it in your own interpretation of the froggie FAFO meme!

[u/BolesCW → u/yellow_parenti]

you have completely missed my point. i do not dispute that the dominant zionist discourse was anti-Yiddish, having to do with them wanting to reject an image of diaspora Jews -- their own parents and neighbors -- who had their own vernacular for navigating that diaspora. the anti-Yiddish campaigns were an *internal* Ashkenazi conflict (the pressure to adopt modern Israeli Hebrew among immigrants from the Middle East and North Africa, on the other hand, was not carried out with any similar vitriol). claiming that Yiddish is the quintessence of diaspora anti-zionism is part of Ashkenormativity, the assumption that eastern European Jews and their culture are the majority, or at least the most important. you are operating under that presumption despite the fact that not all diaspora communities used Yiddish as their vernacular, and so it has limited appeal and limited usefulness as a vernacular to unite anti-zionists. i do not reject Yiddish because i'm on the side of zionist Hebrew supremacists, but because it was never the vernacular of my ancestors, and so is neither attractive nor appealing. english is the most prevalent vernacular of non-Israeli Jews.

[u/yellow_parenti → u/BolesCW]

Dawg, I only suggested using Yiddish (again, for a frog meme; all of this for a damn frog meme) because the OP commented about using Hebrew. Talk to them about the Ashkenormativity.

OP said they wanted to make the frog meme more overtly Jewish. I suggested Yiddish instead of Hebrew because it was particularly prominent in Jewish groups who were day one opponents of Israel (& in Palestine pre British and Zionist settlement) and precisely because Israel went so hard with suppression of it specifically, in the beginning of the colonial project of Israel. I do not have the colonizer mindset grindset brain worms where I racialize issues that are ideological in nature.

Hebrew would also be rather "limited in its usefulness as a vernacular to unite anti-Zionists", but there were no complaints raised about the suggestion to use Hebrew.

Also, no one is trying to suggest that Yiddish be used "to unite anti-Zionists", or that it is "the quintessence of diaspora anti zionism". You are shadow boxing with your own demons; I said nothing of the sort about Yiddish. It's a silly frog meme, let me have my silly little yiddish frog meme in peace, damn.

You personally may not have any connection to Yiddish, but I do. I am speaking from my own perspective, again, ABOUT A MF FROG MEME 😭😭

[u/specialistsets → u/yellow_parenti]

given that Anti-Yiddishism was official policy of Israel for a while

This was never official state policy, it was socially driven by other Ashkenazi Zionists who rejected Yiddish as a relic of their diaspora. Yiddish had also been on the decline since the mid-late 19th century and was already no longer spoken by many Ashkenazi Jews who only spoke spoke their local languages like Polish, Russian, German, etc.

[u/yellow_parenti → u/specialistsets]

Thanks for trying to explain my family's history to me ig? Lol. Wiki: "... in the 1950s Israeli law banned Yiddish-language theaters and forced civil servants to adopt Hebrew surnames."

The og melting pot law in newly Zionist occupied Palestine required immigrants to learn Hebrew and usually change their surnames to something more Hebrew sounding.

I really did not mean for this to turn into a conversation that is centered around ethnic groups. I absolutely despise the hand waving of differences in ideology, just to then fixate on ethnicity. That's some colonizer mindset bs.

I thought it would be obvious that my seconding of Yiddish for use in the silly frog meme- rather than Hebrew- was due to the prevalence of Yiddish in early anti-Zionist Jewish movements & in Palestine pre British and Zionist settlement. Oy ir narishe tsionistn and all that jazz. But ig I'll just take my dirty commie self elsewhere with my dirty commie language 😭 All this about a damn frog meme.

[u/specialistsets → u/yellow_parenti]

The og melting pot law in newly Zionist occupied Palestine required immigrants to learn Hebrew and usually change their surnames to something more Hebrew sounding.

There was no explicit law against Yiddish and Hebraization of names was never required for civilians.

[u/yellow_parenti → u/specialistsets]

I was paraphrasing what is said on the page I linked, so yes. There was. Like I said. The link is there for a reason.

Here's another one: "Anti-Yiddishism was once official Israeli government policy..."

Again, thanks for attempting to enlighten me on my own family history with nothing but unfounded confidence.

[u/specialistsets → u/yellow_parenti]

What was this policy? The Wikipedia claim is unsourced and modern scholarship refutes this, see Rachel Rojanski's "Yiddish in Israel" which is the authoritative history of this era. There is no doubt that there were intense societal pressures for all immigrants to speak Hebrew, but there was no specific policy targeting Yiddish and there was indeed very active Yiddish journalism for decades.

[u/[deleted]]

Hop around, find out

[u/TheOBRobot]

I can appreciate the Passover reference but people will think this is just ironic French nationalism

[u/[deleted]]

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Hebrew may be messed up, I'm only currently learning it so I had to use Google translate. It should say "let our people go"

[u/daloypolitsey]

Another one

[u/conscience_journey → u/daloypolitsey]

My favorite one so far. If I were any good at editing I would add some red to the image, maybe adding a locust for another plague, and put the action at the bottom to be more like the original.

[u/watermelonkiwi]

I don’t think most people will understand this.

[u/pinko-perchik]

I’m dying for some context here, lmao

[u/daloypolitsey → u/pinko-perchik]

The frog is the second plague. FAFO stands for "fuck around and find out"

[u/zorrozorro_ducksauce → u/daloypolitsey]

Fuck around and frogs out

[u/pinko-perchik → u/daloypolitsey]

Okay that is what I initially thought, lol

[u/BolesCW → u/daloypolitsey]

some commentators say it was a crocodile.

[u/Acrobatic-Engineer94]

As an animal lover, I approve.

[u/Acrobatic-Engineer94 → u/Acrobatic-Engineer94]

[u/Dialogue_Tag]

As a nonjewish design student living in a country with virtually no Jewish architecture/design presence, this is sick as hell

[u/sammachado]

Gotta be posting this without context bye

[u/[deleted]]

If they're feeling froggy..they ought to leap?